Articles

Great Northern Railway Historical Society
Reference Sheet No. 217
June 1994

THE TRAIN
"As wonderful as the country it serves"

As with other long distance trains of the era, the Oriental Limited had numerous changes of locomotives and sleepers as it traversed its routes. The number of sleeping cars varied with season and direction of travel. Its scheduled times through the major cities meant that more sleepers and were carried eastbound.

MOTIVE POWER

Mountains, Pacifics, Ten Wheelers and Atlantics were assigned to the train as it crossed the various divisions in 1924. Over the next five years, Great Northern kept acquiring new locomotives or rebuilding older power for use on the Oriental. Normally, the train was handled without helpers except on the 2.2% ascending grades between Seattle and Wenatchee, the 1.8% grade eastbound on Walton Hill and the 1.6% grade westbound out of St. Paul. The accompanying chart indicates that in 1924, fourteen changes of locomotives, not counting the Electrics through the Cascade Tunnel, were needed for each trip.

The locomotive most associated with the 1924 Oriental Limited was the P-2 Mountain. Prior to building the new trains, a study was made of the motive power requirements, since it was realized the heaviest passenger locomotives then in use would not have the capacity needed to efficiently handle the heavier equipment. After studying the problem, an order was placed with Baldwin for 28 Mountains, which were built and delivered in late 1923.

Initially, the Mountains were limited to a maximum speed of 50 miles per hour and made 4800 miles per month. The engines were single crewed, a standard practice of the time. The 10 which were operated east of Cut Bank were coal burners and the remaining 18 used west of Cut Bank were oil fired. The P-2's were used eastbound on the Oriental through New Rockford but not westbound through Grand Forks. The Mountains could handle 10-12 cars up Walton Hill without a helper at 18 miles per hour. [Reference sheet #122 provides additional information on the P-2 class Mountains.]

East of the Rockies, the H-4 Pacifics, which performed satisfactorily in mainline passenger service continued to be used. The new H-5 proved more successful than the H-4 and more were added to the remunda. Finally, in 1925 a booster was added to the H-5 design and the H-7 was created. The H-7 seems to have protected the Oriental between Spokane and Whitefish from 1925. A picture of an H-7 on the point of the Oriental appears in Wood's Lines West on page 70.

The Class E-14 Ten Wheelers had proven to be speedy and satisfactory locomotives for certain types of passenger service. In 1924, they were assigned Westbound between Devil's Lake and Minot, North Dakota, where the maximum grade was only 0.6%. But, in spite of the wide firebox, they lacked the boiler power needed for the work on the Oriental and were soon withdrawn.

In anticipation of the new train, Great Northern rebuilt the class K-1 Atlantics which were fitted with superheaters and bolsters. The tractive effort was raised from 23,000# to 33,000#. These locomotives were placed in service between Wolf Point and Havre. It is interesting to note on the chart that the K-1's, with the lightest tractive effort, were carded for the fastest time over the eastbound run. Nevertheless, these locomotives were gradually phased out as more H-5's and booster equipped H-7's were built in 1925-26.

The Cascades were the domain of the P-2 Mountains. Initially, the B-B Electrics were coupled on to the Mountains at Tye and Scenic for the trip through the original Cascade Tunnel. This changed in 1927 when the Z and Y class Electrics arrived and assumed the chore of towing the P-2's through the tunnel. Starting in 1929, when the new Cascade Tunnel was placed in service, the Mountains were cut on and off at Wenatchee and Skykomish. A picture of a pair of Z class Electrics leading the Oriental over the Foss Creek trestle appears in Wood's Lines West on page 137.

Building the New Cascade Tunnel meant that a faster schedule would be possible. In anticipation of a new faster transcontinental schedule, Great Northern decided to obtain locomotives of greater capacity. Six Northern types were ordered from Baldwin. The S-1 class Northerns were completed in May 1929 and immediately assigned to the Oriental. The S-1 was better fitted for work on long grades where sustained high power was required. Until 1931, when the Oriental was withdrawn, these locomotives were used exclusively in passenger service between Havre and Whitefish. They handled as many as 18 heavyweight cars in both directions. If there were more than 13 cars a helper was added over Walton Hill.

In March and April 1930, 14 S-2 Northerns were acquired. These fine locomotives were intended for the Oriental Limited, Empire Builder and the Fast Mail. Initially they were assigned to the Spokane - Wenatchee and the Williston - Havre sections of the line. Both divisions featured the long tangents, easy curves, and light grades for which the S-2's 80" drivers were designed. Reference sheet #40 contains additional information on the S-2 class.

THE EQUIPMENT CONSIST

Eight sets of equipment consisting of the RPO/baggage, a first and second class coach, a tourist sleeper, a diner, four sleepers, and an observation arrived in 1924. Between 1924 and 1929 one more observation, upgraded coaches, additional sleepers and diners were added to the equipment pool.

In addition, express reefers were carried in season on the eastbound train. These cars, destined for eastern markets, were laden with Northwest fruit and produce. In Summer, car loads of both Puget Sound and Alaskan Salmon, fresh off the Seattle docks, were expedited east on its faster schedule . A picture of several express reefers on the headend of the Oriental appears in Wood's Lines West on page 81. Coincidental to the inauguration of the new Oriental, fifty additional express refrigerator cars were built by Seimens-Stemble in 1924. Additional information on these cars can be found in Reference sheet #165.

The interior of the entire train, from the coaches to the observation, was decorated in the same uniform, harmonious, light green enamel scheme. None of the cars were furnished with air- conditioning and this was the last new train equipped with friction journals, as all subsequent new passenger cars rode on roller bearings.

The normal arrangement of the ten car consist was the RPO/Baggage, second class coach, first class coach, tourist, 12-1 Pullman, 12-1 Pullman, diner, 12-1 Pullman, 10-1-2 Pullman, Observation. In 1924, each sleeping car was assigned an alpha designation as its line number. As a convenience to passengers, the car designations were provided in the booklet Oriental Limited Train
Directory.

HEADEND

In the Spring of 1924, eight steel 70' RPO/Baggage cars from the 52-71 series were repainted and put in shape at the St. Paul shops. The cars had been built in 1918 by American Car and Foundry, (AF&C) and were the most modern headend equipment on the roster. At one end, the cars were equipped with a 30' Railway Post Office apartment. In the middle, separating the two areas, was a 10' fish rack area. Fish racks were duck boards in the floor which permitted melting ice to drain without spoiling the perishable shipments. At the other end, the baggage and express area contained a dynamo generator, safe, desk letter case and toilet facilities for a baggage messenger. The dynamo provided thirty two volt direct current power for the appliances, like the train's vacuum cleaners, hair curling irons, electric toasters and valet's pressing iron. Wood's Lines West on page 84 has a photograph of this car involved in a wreck on March 11, 1928 at Peshastin, WA. Reference sheet #100 provides additional information on these cars.

SECOND CLASS COACH

The smoking car involved a departure from the standard previously used on deluxe trains. It provided space in the forward end for the dining car crew's sleeping accommodations. Four tourist sections were built in the forward end with sufficient locker and toilet facilities for the crew. The space was later expanded to six sections. This arrangement gave additional coach space in the daytime and accommodations for the dining car crew at night. Experience had shown that there were always more passengers using the coaches in the day time than at night. The 70' second class coaches were initially built by AC&C in 1913 as standard coaches and carried the numbers 3700-3707. Steel sheathing and underframe was applied to these cars in 1924 and they were renumbered 643-650 in 1926. As more diners were acquired, more of the 70' coaches in the 3700 series were converted to this configuration. Between 1925-28, all remaining cars in the 3700 series received steel sheathing.

FIRST CLASS COACH

Initially, first class coaches numbers 950-959 were assigned primarily for long distance passengers. These eighty foot all steel cars were built in 1914 by Barney and Smith and had an eighty-six passenger configuration. A change from the standard arrangement was the provision of a woman's lavatory across the aisle from the woman's toilet. If traffic warranted, coaches 960-979 which were almost identical, may have also been assigned.

In 1926, coaches 920-927 replaced the 950-959 series coaches. They had been built by Barney & Smith in 1910 as 86 passenger standard coaches. In 1925 and 1926 they were upgraded for use on the Oriental. Steel sheathing was applied to the exterior and they received an enlarged mens room as a smoker, which resulted in the seating capacity being reduced to 70 passengers. The interiors were painted the Oriental Limited shade of green.

PULLMAN BUILT CARS

The cars which Pullman built were all steel and represented latest designs and the newest features available. The diners and sleepers contained slightly different features, perhaps owing to the fact that the diners were built for GN, and Pullman would retain ownership of the sleepers. The May 24, 1924 edition of Railway Age provides the following information:

[Diners] "The mechanical specialties used on this car are as follows: Commonwealth cast-steel six-wheel trucks, high equalized type with pedestals cast integral with the frame and a device for locking the trucks to the body of the car; 5-1/2 by 10-in journals; 36-in rolled steel wheels; simplex clasp brakes; miner draft gear, type A-5-P-X; Miner buffer device, type B-10; new York Air brakes, UC-1612 equipment; Woods roller side bearings; Vapor heat and monel metal, used through out the kitchen and pantry."

[Standard Sleepers] "The mechanical specialties on these cars are as follows: Commonwealth cast steel six-wheel trucks, high equalizer type with pedestal frames cast integral and safety locking pins; clasp brakes, and 36 1/2-in rolled steel wheels on axles with 5-in by 9-in journals."

[Additional information on the heavyweight diners and sleepers can be found in Reference Sheet #110.]

TOURIST

In May 1924, eight cars were rebuilt by Pullman from older 12-1 sleepers by converting the former men's room to the valet-barber shop and shower bath. The drawing room was rebuilt for use as a men's smoking area. Although tourist sleepers had been carried on the Oriental since 1905, the eight tourist sleepers were an innovation because of the valet-barber shop. The Tourist cars were divided into two sections and separated by a door in the aisleway. The forward part consisted of 12 tourist sleeper sections, which had no bulkhead between berths. The women's retiring room and men's smoking room were on either side of the berths in the forward section. The men's and women's rooms were much larger and better appointed than had previously been provided in tourist cars.

At the rear section, the car featured valet service, a barber chair and men's shower bath. This change in the Oriental's design followed a trend found on other important flyers of the Twenties. The mark of big city Limiteds was to place a barbershop, frequently with a smoker/library, in the forward end of the train. The best barbers were recruited from metropolitan areas for this duty. The barber shaved passengers for two bits and cut hair for four bits. Also in his joint capacity as valet, he pressed a three piece suit for six bits and left the sleeves round if you so wished. The barber/valet shop was equipped with a thirty-two volt direct current activated electric pressing iron which was specially manufactured for railroad usage. The train's vacuum cleaners and electric toasters were also thirty two volt appliances.

It is believed that the tourist sleepers were numbered 1725-1732 but this has not been confirmed, except for photos which exist of car 1728. The photograph indicates that the car rode on standard Pullman six-wheel trucks, not the commonwealth trucks used on the other Pullman built cars.

DINING CAR

G.N introduced its 'State' series of dining cars on the new train. The eight new dining cars were completed by Pullman in May 1924. They were the first of an eventual 22 identical cars which would continue to operate in mainline service into the Fifties. Each car accommodated 36 patrons at each sitting, and carried a crew of twelve. The interiors were painted in different harmonious shades of green. The adornment of the car consisted of light tones throughout, giving the restful effect of a well decorated room. Fresh cut flowers from G.N. greenhouses and gardens brightened each table, and presented a pleasant impression on the bright white linens and beside the shining crystal and silverware.

The dinner hour was announced by the traditional melodious chimes. The menu featured Great Northern style chicken pie, baked salmon, Wenatchee apple pie, G.N. beans and smoked ham. The nature of the area served logically influenced the introduction into the dining car menu of such items as Washington apples, clams, salmon and other territorial specialties. The specialties included berries and vegetables from the Northwest, prize winning Minnesota butter, and North Dakota beef. For breakfast, Great Northern Health Griddle Cakes were offered.

Like all railroad diners, the menu advised patrons that employees were forbidden to accept written orders. The Oriental's menu also invited mothers to send baby's bottle to the dining car to be sterilized and filled. In summer months, the eastbound Oriental slowed each day at Stryker, Montana, so that the telegraph operator could hand up a package of freshly caught mountain trout to dining car personnel, who quickly prepared them for appreciative patrons. Diner patrons received a complimentary copy of the recipe book Great Northern Secrets.

The car was built with an especially large and well-arranged kitchen, which even had electric toasters. Monel metal was used through out the kitchen and pantry. From this area, GN crews established the well earned reputation for meal service. Unlike the sleepers, Great Northern continued to own and operate the dining cars which were serviced and supplied from G.N.'s commissaries. They were located at Seattle, Spokane, Great Falls, and St. Paul.

Initially, the diners carried both names and numbers. 7000-7007 were ordered in 1924 and two more were received in 1925. It is believed that these were the only diners lettered for the Oriental Limited. In 1926, the cars were renumbered. However, the diners remained lettered for the Oriental Limited until 1931.

Name	Build Date	Original Number	New Number
OREGON	1924	7000	1030
WISCONSIN	1924	7001	1031
MINNESOTA	1924	7002	1032
IOWA	1924	7003	1033
MONTANA	1924	7004	1034
IDAHO	1924	7005	1035
WASHINGTON	1924	7006	1036
ILLINOIS	1924	7007	1037
NORTH DAKOTA	1925	7008	1038
SOUTH DAKOTA	1925	7009	1039

Additional cars of this series were built in anticipation of the 1929 Empire Builder. [The names of the additional cars are contained in Reference Sheet 110.]

STANDARD SLEEPERS

The new Pullman sleepers included the newest features such as draft-free permanent headboards, individual venting devices and a men's smoking and club room. For women, the retiring room featured large mirrors, dressing tables, plenty of chairs, and a host of minor refinements. The sleepers were decorated in the same light green enamel scheme as the rest of the train.

Each car was assigned a Pullman porter, who during the day kept the car neat and tidy, supplied information about the route, and rendered any assistance which was requested. Among the services which they provided to passengers was getting ice and beverages, setting up portable tables and furnishing playing cards. In the evening, they made up the berths. At night, they shined the shoes that the passengers left out and woke up any passenger who was detraining.

For passengers obtaining space in the sections, the Pullman practice was to sell the forward-facing seat with the lower berth and the backward-facing seat with the upper.

Breakfast in bed was available to passengers holding compartment or drawing room space, and was depicted in company photographs and advertising. Though once widely considered a symbol of practically Byzantine luxury, in actual practice, its satisfactions were reported to be no more than minimal.

Little could be done, however, even with the best intentions, to glamorize the men's smoking compartments in Pullman Standard. It was proverbially the scene of pre-breakfast chaos, trailing galluses, lathered faces, bad tempers, and untidiness in general. Occupants wearing ties, as depicted in publicity photographs, were purely illusionary.

The Oriental Carried two sleeper configurations: the 10-1-2 and the standard 12-1.

Sleeper type 10-1-2, Plan 4770, Lot 3585, Built May/June 1924:
Eight 10-1-2 LAKE series were built, and one was assigned to each consist. This car was operated exclusively between Chicago and Portland, and provided a compartment and drawing room facilities for Portland passengers comparable to space offered to Seattle passengers in the Observation. The LAKE series were placed immediately ahead of the Observation except Eastbound, when the Helena car was cut in between the two at Havre. This type of car last appears in the Spring 1929 timetable, and was dropped from the Oriental's consist when the train assumed the Glacier Park Limited's schedule. Although this plan was never used by Great Northern again in transcontinental service, many of the Lake series names were used again as diners in the 1947 Builder.

Names of the car were:

BOWMAN LAKE	HIDDEN LAKE
DEVIL'S LAKE	HOWARD LAKE
GUNSIGHT LAKE	JOSEPHINE LAKE
HARRISON LAKE	MEDICINE LAKE

12-1 Standard Sleeper:

The ubiquitous 12-1 sleepers provided operational flexibility by being added to or set out, of the consist. The three lots built for the Oriental Limited totaled 42 cars. The initial lot of 26 cars indicates that three were planned for each consist. In the first year there were 32 cars, or 4 per train. The names for the first lot and proposed names for the third lot were selected for cities along the line and matched the state names on the diners. Names were selected by G.N.and reflect on-line stations. The second batch, which were all 'MC series names', may have been an emergency allocation due to the popularity of the train. The last batch was initially going to be named for stations.

The initial 26 cars were built for the train and named for towns and cities along the Great Northern. They were part of a group of 50 cars, the remainder of which carried the MC prefix.

Plan 3410, Lot 4763, Built April/June 1924

ANACONDA	CHINOOK	VANCOUVER
ANACORTES	CROOKSTON	WANETA
ARMINGTON	GLACIER	WAHPETON
BELTON	HAVRE	WAYZATA
BERTHOLD	LITCHFEILD	WENATCHEE
BISON	ROCKPORT	WILLISTON
BLUESTEM	SEATTLE	WILLMAR
CASHMERE	SUPERIOR	WINNIPEG
CASSELTON	TACOMA

The second lot of six cars were part of a larger group of 225 cars which carried the prefix 'MC'. It is possible that the assignment of these cars was only an interim measure until the third group was built.

Plan 3410, Lot 4764, Built June/August 1924:

MCDONOUGH	MCHUGH	MCKENNA
MCGREGOR	MCINTOSH	MCKINLEY

The third group of ten cars was built in the following year. Initially they were to also carry the names of towns along the route. However, the intended names were changed to names of men who played a part in the exploration and building of the West, similar to the names used on the 1929 Empire Builder.

Plan 3410, Lot 4845, Built February/May 1925

Intended Name	Actual Name
BAINVILLE	AGASSIZ
BEMIDJI	GROSSEILLERS
BRECKENRIDGE	LARPENTEUR
DAKOTA	LEWIS
GEARHART	MACKENZIE
HOLLOWAY	MAXIMILIAN
KALAMA	PIKE
MILACA	STEVENS
NEDHART	THOMPSON
PENDROY	VERENDRYE

OBSERVATIONS

Eight GREAT series observation cars were delivered in 1924 and Great Northern ordered a ninth car in 1926. The new Pullman observation cars featured higher and wider windows for better viewing of the scenery and were the last to be delivered to the Great Northern with an open platform. The observations were decorated like the other cars except with red carpets and 'Adam' style motif. At the forward end, the car had a buffet, a smoking room for men, and a tastefully decorated women's lounge room with shower bath. The middle contained a Pullman drawing room and two compartments for Seattle passengers. At the rear there was an observation room with seating capacity for 14 people. Finally, the car had a large outside platform with seating capacity for eight passengers.

As aboard all the other trains of transcontinental consequence, a lady's maid was felt to be indispensable aboard the Oriental Limited. Great Northern's management stressed her presence in reassuring publicity photographs. Maids on the Oriental were given a thorough training course by the Pullman company before they entered regular train service. Manicure, massage and hairdressing services were available to lady passengers. The ladies maid-manicurist was located mid-car in the woman's lounge and bath area. Electric curling irons were available in the ladies dressing room.

The observation lounge was a center of activity where, like the diner, fresh cut flowers from G.N. greenhouses were always present. The observation area had a radio, a library featuring books on the west and Glacier Park, a magazine rack, and a writing table. In keeping with the Oriental theme, a card adaption of the Chinese game, Mah Jongg was available to passengers, as well as cards and bridge score pads containing the Oriental's logo. Stamps were available from the Pullman porter who also provided beverages and snacks from the buffet.

Every afternoon at four, tea was served in the lounge by a waiter from the diner. Close behind followed a maid with a platter of dainty cakes. A telephone was located in the lounge and was connected at Tacoma, Seattle, St. Paul and Chicago during the station stops. The lounge carried telephone directories for those four cities. News and market reports were telegraphed to stations and placed on board the observation lounge several times a day. The conveniences of the Observation Car, including afternoon tea, were free to standard sleeping car passengers.

At the end platform, on the brass railing, hung a new electric tail sign in red and white, replacing the old oil illuminated type. The Oriental's staid white drumhead with the black words 'Oriental Limited' and a large orange circle was replaced by the mountain goat of the G.N. Old Bill, as he was called in 1924, stood on a lofty peak and was monarch of all he surveyed in the Northwest. According to railroad historian William Kratville,

"It was not unusual, after the lounge shut down for the night, to see the brakeman sitting at the rear window with only the lights from his flagging lanterns on the platform and the leaking gleam from the tail sign weakly illuminating the scene. And, every now and then a semaphore would slowly wink back to green in the darkness behind the train."

According to Wood's Great Northern Railway, the observation cars were all named in the Great Circle series referring to the shorter route out of the Northwest ports across the North Pacific to the Orient.

Plan 3953, Lot 4782, Built May 1924

GREAT CIRCLE	GREAT LAKES	GREAT PLAINS
GREAT DIVIDE	GREAT NECK *	GREAT SPIRIT
GREAT FALLS	GREAT NORTHERN	GREAT BEAR

* Name changed to GREAT CHIEF in 1926

The GREAT BEAR was built in June 1926 as Pullman plan 3953A, lot 4955. The builder's photograph indicates that unlike the other Observations which rode on Commonwealth trucks, the Great Bear had standard Pullman six wheel trucks.

After the Oriental was withdrawn in 1931, these cars were returned to Pullman, where they were repainted and placed in the Pullman pool. There is no evidence that they were ever reassigned to operate on the G.N.